Perseus PMC Application #1 - James Warren (Agent1667) [Cadet Trial]

Discussion in 'Perseus PMC Applications' started by Agent1667, Dec 21, 2014.

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  1. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    They should always follow Space Law to the best of their ability.

    Why? It is our job to uphold the law at all times. Space Law is not a guideline, it is a set of laws we have to enforce on the server, because it is our job.

    When? All the time. You sign up to play Security, you better be security and follow space law. It is essential to make sure that criminals do their time, and make sure they get served fairly.
  2. Tharinoma

    Tharinoma LS13 Admin

    So criminals should always be brigged no matter what their intent is?
    NoFaceMan and CYBORZ like this.
  3. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    I believe in warnings for offenses that are minor. Intent does matter, and a criminal is classified as a criminal if and only if they commit a crime.

    I would permabrig a man if he murdered the Captain. I would permabrig anybody else if they attempted to thwart my arrest. (Example: Joe Biden kills the Captain, I arrest Joe. Hilary Clinton runs in and tries to take the prisoner. Therefore, she is an accomplice and will receive the same treatment as Joe. The intent of the murderer was to murder, and by freeing the murder, you share the same intent / goals.)

    Of course, if somebody committed vandalism and I arrested them, and somebody else tried to free them, they wouldn't be arrested unless they continue to stop the arresting procedure. I would only arrest for aiding and abetting only if the crime of the original criminal is severe.
  4. Flavo

    Flavo Well-Known Member

    You are the supply officer, one of the cargo techs is running in circles in the central primary hallway naked smoking a rollie. How do you approach this situation?
  5. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    I politely tell him to put some clothes on and remove the rollie. Considering there are no pressing issues to attend to, and if he refused, then I would arrest him for incident exposure, drug possession, and resisting arrest. He would be searched, and any contraband would be taken from his person. I would them tell him to get a medical card for his rollie habit, and send him on his way after his time is served.
  6. Flavo

    Flavo Well-Known Member

    He refuses to put clothes on, says "its a free station" and walks into the bar and takes a seat. What do you do from here and why? (i know you just answered, i would like to know more in depth about why the decision was made)
  7. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    It may be a free station, but a free station is not a lawless station. I would give him a final chance to submit to law peacefully. If he refused, then he would be arrested for incident exposure and resisting arrest. (And drug possession if he still had the rollie.)

    Why? It is my job to uphold the law. He broke the law, and refused to correct himself.
  8. Flavo

    Flavo Well-Known Member

    So you would arrest him simply because space law says it is illegal and it must be enforced, However you are capable of making your own decisions and choosing your own battles. Space law is not absolute, It even says that in space law itself and noone is going to yell at you for ignoring a naked man simply just being naked or smoking a rollie. If we wanted security drones and a automated brig system we would develop one but having a human being is much more suitable. In my opinion you are wasting your own time and the naked guys time by arresting him simply because space law says that this is illegal. You will probably enrage the naked guy too to retaliate and maybe up his crimes to even worse crimes such as assault. There are more important things to focus on, you should use space law as a guideline. Sure if hes being naked and punching people or breaking into a place or emoteing pissing on people yeah do something about that but simply being naked isn't a problem. thoughts?
    Mindtrixx, NoFaceMan and JPR like this.
  9. JPR

    JPR Well-Known Member

    I'd cut him some slack for that answer. I know I might SAY I'd arrest that guy but if I'd ignore it, if I ever got time between the DUALESWORDER, the ROILING WAVE OF DEATHFLAME POURING FROM THE STATION VENTS, and the "OH GOD WHERE IS MEDBAY" bomb :D.
    That said, instead of the PROPER SECURITY ANSWER if we were a high roleplay server, what would you really do?
  10. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    Him retaliating would do nothing but make it worse for himself. I'm not with the popular opinion that Space Law is only a guideline.

    The man in question was warned and refused to listen to the law, making him subject to the extent of the law. If you disobey one law, you are bound to disobey another, and another, and another, until the list ends with a capital crime. I would not be wasting my time, because I prioritize issues.
  11. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    I would do as I said previously, unless there is a more pressing issue to attend to. I always give a moderate level of roleplay, so this would fall in accordance with what I do.
  12. Flavo

    Flavo Well-Known Member

    Either I've completely missed it or this is something new. I don't believe I've seen you be a "To the T" type of security drone, I'm curious if this was always the case or learned recently.

    That being asked I'm fairly certain Ive been able to see you think for yourself as a officer and are capable of going "yeah this isn't really a big deal"... the old saying "It isn't a problem until its a problem"
    Flatoftheblade likes this.
  13. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    I would do as I said previously, unless there is a more pressing issue to attend to. I always give a moderate level of roleplay, so this would fall in accordance with what I do.
  14. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    Of course, if somebody is screaming for help at escape, I'm not going to arrest the naked man smoking a blunt in the hallway, I would go as far to let him out of his handcuffs then.

    I guess my To the T attitude has been more of a recent thing.
  15. JPR

    JPR Well-Known Member

    Well. As long as you aren't playing a rules-obsessed Inspector Javert sec officer (would be AWESOME) who chases a naked assistant for 30 minutes ignoring traitors and fire so you can dispense JUSTICE, then I'm ok with it. Out of curiosity, have you ever arrested someone for indecent exposure, or drug possession? Not a criticism if not, I would think it was a rare round where there wasn't anything more serious happening.
    Flatoftheblade and Agent1667 like this.
  16. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    I have arrested botanists (read: Ryan Leech) for selling narcotics before. I don't think for indecent exposure.
  17. Flavo

    Flavo Well-Known Member

    My advice, use your judgement
    Take priority of securing the station and the people who inhabit it. good luck and have fun.
    JPR and Agent1667 like this.
  18. Tharinoma

    Tharinoma LS13 Admin

    "The rules and regulations herein are not absolutes, instead they exist to serve mainly as guidelines for the law and order of the dynamic situations that exist for stations on the frontiers of space, as such some leeway is permitted."
    Quoted form spess law.

    Space law isn't only a guideline, but it's a guideline nonetheless.

    "If you disobey one law, you are bound to disobey another, and another, and another, until the list ends with a capital crime."

    I have dealt with alot of greytiding shitsistants in my time as an officer on SS13. I completely disagree with this point of view. From my experience, giving warnings instead of brigging people, and searching instead of arresting usually puts the crew on your side. Everyone hates the officer that follows space law to the letter and doesn't give a carp to why you were tresspassing.

    I suggest "using your brain" and relying more on common sense when making decisions as a security officer. Security isn't here to uphold the law. It's here to maintain order, protect the crew and the station, and space law is their tool.

    You're an above average security officer, from what I saw. I will be watching you.
    JPR, Agent1667 and Flavo like this.
  19. Agent1667

    Agent1667 Well-Known Member


    I'm glad you will be watching me. I think you will be more pleased with how I react to these situations rather than how I am trying to express my point of view on the thread.
    JPR, Flatoftheblade and Flavo like this.
  20. Time to make it official. I've played lots of security with James Warren. I've consistently seen responsiveness, communication, good judgement and professionalism. In regards to allegations that he is robotic and fails to take context into consideration, I will say that I have never seen him perform an arrest under circumstances where the necessity defense would be applicable, and I have seen him argue against questionable actions by superiors when it was appropriate to do so. He is not some officious ass (like this: http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...askatoon_police_for_not_wearing_seatbelt.html) and he is not rude or abrasive to subjects (quite the contrary), he just will put his foot down when necessary. He will not do something that is a risk to the safety and security of the station and crew, just for the sake of being "nice" to a criminal. I don't see this as a bad thing.

    "I Flatoftheblade SPONSOR Agent1667, AND HEREBY TAKE PARTIAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR THEM ACTING AS PERSEUS ENFORCERS, IN THE EVENT THAT THEY ARE HIRED."
    ProbablyBaron, LeJack and Agent1667 like this.
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